Is fascism alive and well in the conservative movement?

Filed in National by on July 15, 2007

You be the Judge.

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Jason330 is a deep cover double agent working for the GOP. Don't tell anybody.

Comments (16)

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  1. Duffy says:
    July 15, 2007 at 7:37 am

    Compare and contrast:

    The above link with this one:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Heku9oTLysg

    and I quote: “This is treason and we need to start treating them now as traitors.”

    Disagreement with him is treason. That is fascism. Not from some random person on a beach. An elected official.

  2. jason330 says:
    July 15, 2007 at 8:00 am

    You did not mention whether or not you thought the desire to gas liberal is fascist. Take on that first and maybe I’ll entertian your red herring arguments.

  3. Alan Coffey says:
    July 15, 2007 at 9:23 am

    If the shoe fits (Wikipedia):

    Socialism refers to a broad array of ideologies and movements which aim to improve society through collective action and to a socio-economic system in which property and the distribution of wealth are subject to control by the community

    Fascism is an authoritarian political ideology (generally tied to a mass movement) that considers individual and other societal interests subordinate to the needs of the state

    Both scare me. Taking my liberty in the name of the People is bad enough, but to take my liberty in the name of the State is just insane. We are the State AND we are the community. Don’t let the politicians take either of those away. Cherish your freedoms to do and not to be done to. In order to do that I firmly believe we must resist the Bush expansion of executive authority.

  4. jason330 says:
    July 15, 2007 at 9:33 am

    Alan,

    You’ve been a consistent libertarian voice around here so I just have to ask – which poses a greater threat to our liberty right now.

    The fascism of George Bush or the socialism of Dennis Kucinich?

    Also, if I may be so bold, did you vote for Bush when he ran against Gore? I know many Libertarians felt duped having done so.

  5. Duffy says:
    July 15, 2007 at 12:56 pm

    My argument isn’t a red herring. Moreover, I was illustrating the disparate impact of one random woman on the beach talking about gassing liberals (More than likely she was being hyperbolic or attempting to be funny) vs. a sitting member of Congress talking about trying people for a capital offense for disbelieving unproven assertions.

  6. oedipa maas says:
    July 15, 2007 at 2:25 pm

    Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. is not a sitting member of Congress.

    Kennedy does not define disagreement with him as treason. He does provide a fairly extensive list of sins of omission and commission by members of the government, their corporate friends and the press that he claims sells out the rest of us. That is what he calls treason. And he is not asking for anyone in that group to gas or kill those who he thinks are doing the wrong thing.

    Certainly disagree with his reasons, but he is in no way charging treason because someone disagrees with him.

    The facsist bent of the current conservative crop is pretty pervasive and David Neiwert over at Orcinus documents what he can. The woman on the beach was not likly being hyperbolic (and who really talks about gassing anyone as being funny?), but repeats the kind of crap that passes for conservative radio all of the time. Micheal Savage, Glen Beck and a host of village idiots on the radio don’t have much going on except to talk about killing people that they disagree with. Michele Malkin does this as do plenty of other mouthpieces of the RNC. Unfortunately, no one on that side — either official or just a member — will condemn the kind of talk that calls for violence against your neighbor (or at least makes it seem acceptable), because they need that fear and bigotry at a fever pitch.

  7. Chris says:
    July 16, 2007 at 2:48 am

    “Micheal Savage, Glen Beck and a host of village idiots on the radio don’t have much going on except to talk about killing people that they disagree with.”

    HELL if I am going let you get away with such bogus BS! I DEFY you to find ANYTIME these mentioned individuals ever ONCE suggested killing people that they disagree with. I have heard more of that CRAP from the left who would like to NUKE the entire administration.

    Start with extreme HATE on the left before you point out your imagined extreme on the right.

    As for the original article mentioned. First and foremost, IF this is not some wild concoction from yet another “unbiased” journalist, then I can GUARANTEE you that this 50 some people are so DO NOT speak for conservatives in general and if you seriously try to paint me and members of my ilk as such then we have a serious problem. I don’t bend to insane foolish left-wing slander. Grow up!

  8. Von Cracker says:
    July 16, 2007 at 11:13 am

    I read this over the weekend and I’m certainly glad you got to this, Jason. I was going to post a link to it if no one did, just for the sole purpose of seeing the lame, false excuses the freepers come up with.

    To all of the deniers, this was THE NATIONAL REVIEW yearly cruise, hosted by the Godfather of the modern conservative movement, William Buckley (who, sadly enough, is considered to be too moderate now!). These jerks are the hardcore base of the GOP. How can you say it’s not? THE LEADING RIGHT-WING PERIODICAL OFFERS A CRUISE AND ONLY LUKE-WARM GOP SUPPORTERS ATTEND? GET REAL!!!

    Chris – you can’t stand the hypocrisy of your party, can you? Because the excuse you offer is “attack the messenger”, a typical tactic, easy to notice, and shows in bright neon the lack of any worthwhile argument. No need to “Start with extreme HATE on the left before you point out your imagined extreme on the right.”, because if you cannot hate these pieces of extreme shit, then as true Americans, who can we despise?

    Come back when you have something to say that’s worth factual and grounded in reality. Oh yeah, BTW – you’re defied!

    http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53245

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200607140015

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200505180008

    I could go on and on…..(and I didn’t even reference Coultergist and her call to kill supreme court justices and bomb the NYT) But to Chris, these examples never happened. Some crazy liberal has an agenda! So even though the shit’s on tape, he can just excuse it because it doesn’t fit into his world view.

    The lengths the apologists will go to in order to save face from all the issues they’ve gotten WRONG over the past 7 years are absolutely amazing and quite shameful. If the will of these bigots and xenophobes come to fruition, then I would consider the apologists as being tantamount to the Germans living just outside the concentration camps. Remember the townspeople who saw the shipments of human cargo, noticed the constant flow of ash in the sky, and smelled the foul stench of burning flesh? They would not believe their lying senses, refused to put two and two together, all the while claiming ignorance to appease their battle of cognitive dissonance.

  9. Von Cracker says:
    July 16, 2007 at 11:40 am

    Damn wordpress!! It keeps giving me a “you already submitted that comment” BS.

    Shorter version:

    I read this over the weekend and I’m certainly glad you got to this, Jason. I was going to post a link to it if no one did, just for the sole purpose of seeing the lame, false excuses the freepers come up with.

    To all of the deniers, this was THE NATIONAL REVIEW yearly cruise, hosted by the Godfather of the modern conservative movement, William Buckley (who, sadly enough, is considered to be too moderate now!). These jerks are the hardcore base of the GOP. How can you say it’s not? THE LEADING RIGHT-WING PERIODICAL OFFERS A CRUISE AND ONLY LUKE-WARM GOP SUPPORTERS ATTEND? GET REAL!!!

    Chris – you can’t stand the hypocrisy of your party, can you? Because the excuse you offer is “attack the messenger”, a typical tactic, easy to notice, and shows in bright neon the lack of any worthwhile argument. No need to “Start with extreme HATE on the left before you point out your imagined extreme on the right.”, because if you cannot hate these pieces of extreme shit, then as true Americans, who can we despise?

    Come back when you have something to say that’s worth factual and grounded in reality. Oh yeah, BTW – you’re defied!

    http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53245

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200607140015

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200505180008

    I could go on and on…..(and I didn’t even reference Coultergist and her call to kill supreme court justices and bomb the NYT) But to Chris, these examples never happened. Some crazy liberal has an agenda! So even though the shit’s on tape, he can just excuse it because it doesn’t fit into his world view.

  10. Von Cracker says:
    July 16, 2007 at 12:55 pm

    Oops! The truth revealed. Too bad these words came from big contributors and policy wonks of the GOP. And you have to believe that since it was a CRUISE SPONSERED BY THE LEADING RIGHT-WING PERIODICAL IN THIS CUONTRY!!!!

    Chris, per usual, has nothing except a lame “attack the messenger” rant.

    These are your people, GOP; hope you’re proud!

  11. Von Cracker says:
    July 16, 2007 at 12:57 pm

    And since I love sticking it to the authoritarians, Chris…

    Come back when you have something to say that’s worth factual and grounded in reality.

    http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53245

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200607140015

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200505180008

  12. Von Cracker says:
    July 16, 2007 at 12:58 pm

    “COUNTRY”, ugh!

  13. Von Cracker says:
    July 16, 2007 at 1:01 pm

    Here’s your defiance:

    http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53245

    mediamatters.org/items/200607140015

    mediamatters.org/items/200505180008

  14. oedipa maas says:
    July 16, 2007 at 4:54 pm

    Not that you are especially interested in any real information that will interfere with your predigested worldview, Chris. I mean,let’s face it, you are here to make pathetic attempt to be sneeringly better than the rest of us with your faith-based whatever and talking points of the day. Somewhere down the line you lost the thing that most of our parents instilled in us — that there is acceptable behavior and there is unacceptable behavior. The set of normally unacceptable, but acceptable if the guys on my team do it is the kind of thinking that absolutely characteristic of your participation here.

    So here are more facts that you will ignore or wave away because they don’t meet your preconceived notions — but first, how about this informative quiz:

    The Hitler vs Coulter Quiz

    Full disclosure, I got an 8 on this.

    Michael Savage calling for genocide of Muslims

    Fresno Councilperson calling for killing of liberals See also the comments to that report for more invocations of violence to those who have differing political views.

    Or how about Glen Beck mulling over killing Michael Moore?

    And since this shoot fish in a barrel exercise could go on all day, how about all of these eliminationist comments by these republicans, Chris?

    This stuff is not even the tip of the iceburg of the common rhetoric of so-called conservatives of the Bush era. Much of what gets said is meant to be of the eliminationist variety — the kind that paints people that disagree with the speaker as less than human, somehow not worthy of the same constitutional protections, that hurting them is somehow going to be just fine. You will note that they do not engage on ideas — just on impugned motives, the most racist of stereotypes, and manufactured rage.

    And almost to a man, these speakers would consider themselves “Christian”.

    So, Chris, if this is what you are standing up for, God help you. But do know that we already know that you don’t like facts (or sources that support them), that you do like your preconceived notions and yes we know that you’ll tell us that this crap is supposed to be funny.

    But seriously talking about killing people or even advocating for genocide is supposed to be beneath us — it certainly is not Christian by any stretch of the imagination.

  15. Chris says:
    July 18, 2007 at 7:38 am

    First off (here I go killing the messenger again), but Media Matters is hardly an unbiased source. More like “Only lefty liberalism Matters”.

    But that not withstanding. First off, Ann Coulter can crawl under a rock somewhere. She is nothing more than a needy insecure individual who has to constantly say more and more shocking things to get attention. She doesn’t mean ANYTHING she says. She is nothing more than an attention hog.

    Glenn Beck’s comments were taken out of context. He often employs, for entertainment sake, a sarcastic tone, and seemingly extreme view as a way of illustrating absurdity. Once your little Media Matters snitches see this they turn off the TV and fail to ever watch we brings the discussion around to a reasonable point. I know it takes a little intelligence to understand how this works, probably why liberals don’t get it.

    Michael Savage was certainly out of line with his comment about killing 100 million muslims. I thinks his point was to make it clear that contrary to what the media wants us to believe, radical Islam is not just a handful of nut jobs, there is a sizeable segment of the muslim population that espouse this radicalism. Certainly not all, not even a majority, but a sizeable segment none the less.

    Oh, and Media Matters ripped him on that Duke rape victim…what do you know….turns out Savage was right on that. Oh well….

    Of course you have no such people on your side:

    http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/09/17/backpage/9_16_0421_10_52.txt

    http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/latestnews/stories/wfaa070712_lj_nobelprize.69f13db9.html

    http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2006/09/michael-moore-headlines-kill-bush.html

    http://sweetness-light.com/archive/in-book-cindy-sheehan-wishes-she-could-kill-child-bush

    Need I keep going?

  16. Von Cracker says:
    July 18, 2007 at 9:40 am

    Yes, you DO need to keep going….

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