Lessons For Democrats
The biggest lesson for Democrats in this race?
Don’t take your base for granted.
If you run on change, deliver it.
As many have been saying, it’s hard to sell the idea that we must have 60 votes if it means Joe Lieberman and Ben Nelson control the outcome of every vote.
Democrats, prove you can govern. “We only have 59” is no excuse. Figure it out. Instead of these polite gentleman’s filibuster, have a real filibuster. Make ’em read the phone book.
Democrats, learn to use wedge issues. Make Republicans get up and speak against money for a jobs bill, against financial regulation and against health care for Americans. Wrap it around their necks.
For some reason, Democrats chose the hardest path. Trying bipartisanship with an opposition committed to failure and without telling the American people what was happening.
As far as health care reform goes, I’m with Josh Marshall. Working for a year on health care and then killing it is absolutely the worst option. It won’t help Blue Dogs or progressives. Pass the Senate bill and shove the rest through reconciliation. At least TRY. Show us you care about the issues.
OK, rant off.
Tags: Circular Firing Squad, MA-Sen
I’m surprised Lieberman didn’t campaign for Brown.
This is a massive victory for Goldman Sachs.
Keep your rant on, Unstable Isotope. Sustain your outrage, to paraphrase Molly Ivins. By the way, it isn’t that “Democrats chose the hardest path.” It is that Obama did.
I see Democrats aren’t listening to me already. They’ve got the circular firing squad lined up and are shooting away.
And Lieberman and Bayh are already saying that Dems need to move back to the center.
Obama didn’t do this by himself although I think he deferred too much to Senate Democrats. I understand why, he wants them to vote his way but he really should have put his foot down in the summer with the endless and useless “Gang of 6” negotiations.
Anyone else feel like we are rooting for the Eagles of politics?
Circular firing squads only happen where there is no competent political leadership directing which way to point.
conservatives always have and always lose. whether it is supporting the king, supporting slavery, supporting child labor, opposing women’s rights, supporting jim crowe, supporting hitler….. they will always lose
Lesson for democrats???
Drop gun control from the party platform.
You can thank me later.
Blame the Left for Massachusetts
The Wall Street Journal ^ | 01-19-10 | LANNY J. DAVIS
Democrats should be willing to seek common-ground reforms.
Liberal Democrats might attempt to spin the shocking victory of Republican Scott Brown in Massachusetts by claiming that the loss was a result of a poor campaign by Martha Coakley. Would that it were so. This was a defeat not of the messenger, but of the message—and the sooner progressive Democrats face up to that fact, the better.
It’s the substance, stupid!
According to polls, fears about the Democrats’ health-care proposal played a prominent role in Mr. Brown’s victory yesterday. In the last several months, the minority congressional Republicans have dominated the message on health care—and stamped on the Democratic Party the perception that we stand for big government, higher taxes, and health insecurity when it comes to Medicare.
“We only have 59″ is no excuse.
Perhaps “We only have 59″ is destined to become the new “For the past eight years…”
I say no more Mr. Nice Guy to forces of reaction. You can’t seek bipartisan agreements with those who won’t negotiate. The GOP has become the party of reactionaries. They want to stop progress, period. They have defined themselves as the party of “no,” so there is no working with them. They can’t be bargained with or mollified. They can only be fought and defeated.
The loss may be the best thing that has happneded to the democrats. Instead of publicly arguing amongst themselves over watering down health care reform, the democrats will now simply pass the Senate version and move on to the economy.
I’m not sure if it’s the best thing for Democrats, but yes, the public wankery over health care reform really hurt them. I say just pass the Senate bill, prepare a Senate reconciliation package and move on to something else. But use these bills – like job bills as a wedge. Publicly tie Republicans to obstructing bills that help Americans.
What will happen though is the media will start asserting that Democrats tried to do too much narrative. Some people will listen. They won’t learn the lesson of 1994 – that you don’t get any credit for being a Democrat that killed health care reform. Just pass it and get it out of the way. Some Democrats will want to move right, Bayh and Lieberman are already making noises. I hope Democrats know that taking advice from American’s most unpopular Senator is not a good idea.
First, we need to get some real leaders in Congress who have balls and can exact party discipline (similar to Sam Rayburn and LBJ). Pelosi and Reid are worthless. Like them or not, Armey and DeLay got the job done. We’re so damned worried that we’re going to piss off a “loyal” Democratic officeholder. Well, this is the platform, and this is what we need to enact. If you aren’t going to fall in line, then kiss your earmarks and your campaign money goodbye. Oh, and we have a primary opponent for you. And forget this move to the center – Clinton tried it and we lost control of Congress for 12 years.
They say you should look to the past to move forward in the future. So how did Bush get everything he wanted except SS without 60 votes. And he was a wimp.
Nothing will get better for Dems while Harry Reid is Majority Leader.
Reid is a good parliamentarian, but for him to be an effective leader, Rahm and Obama would have to (1) have a light bulb go off over their heads and (2) light a fire under Reid to get the Senate moving. I don’t see either of those things happening.
The good news is that LIEberman is no longer the 60th vote.
This was a comment in DK yesterday RE: Lieberman
blueoasis
Fuck You Lieberman! We have to win. He has enough nerve to mention shady senate deals as a reason that people are pissed. He is one of the main assholes responsible for the senate deals.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/19/lieberman-urges-party-to_n_428686.html
Truth Teller:
Bush, Rove, and Cheney actually worked for their evil schemes by getting out of the White House and campaigning for them. They would campaign to sell their programs directly to the people and then urge them to write their Senators and Reps to support their agenda. They also did lots of fundraisers to get political capital.
Obama and Biden?They just sat in the White House and tried to make deals.
I don’t think any Democrats were taking anything for granted before last night, but you can be sure we aren’t this morning. 2010 is going to be a rugged year and we can’t afford to slack off on any voters. Dem candidates need to show up at every voter’s door. We need to be out there listening and responding. Our volunteers need to show up at every public event. We worked so hard in 2008 and now we’ve got to do it again. In politics the fight is never over. There’s always the next election.
Isn’t the 60th vote either Snowe or Collins unless Democrats figure out how to use their power better?
I don’t think any Democrats were taking anything for granted before last night
I don’t agree with that statement. Massachusetts Democrats did take their voters for granted and they paid the price. National Democrats also ignored the race until the last minute. Democrats have always taken advantage of their base to some degree, that’s why people in the left blogosphere started calling themselves DFHs – people who must be ignored. Well, the blogs were right on this. Democrats lost their base.
you can be sure we aren’t this morning
I hope so, but I heard twice on NPR this morning that Democrats lost because people were concerned that Obama was trying to do too much. That’s the exact opposite lesson they should learn.
Rebecca, I think the White House has been taking everything for granted. Are you missing Dean this morning as much as I am?
U.I. Don’t you think the dynamics in public opinion might change if the Dems didn’t just back down on the threat, but actually made the repubs filibuster?
I think making Republicans talk hurts them. Look how much some of them screwed themselves with the Franken amendment. Of course, they said plenty of crazy things during the Christmas filibuster period.
I think being seen as fighting will help Dems. Dems need to shore up the base.
Personally I think the best option is 1) have the House pass the Senate bill ASAP and 2) have the House introduce a package for reconciliation in the Senate that contains the negotiated changes + the public option. You only need 50 Dems + Biden to pass this.
I think it would also be best for Democrats to move on and focus on jobs and the economy. I don’t want another 6 months of squabbling. Just get it done.
I think they should do the reconciliation with public option part first, since the Senate bill has already passed. I don’t trust Reid or Obama to get it done later.
I think making Republicans talk hurts them.
Exactly.
Dems would do well to review ancient military history. Republicans are massed in a phalanx formation in a defensive posture. A phalanx is very strong but it does have weaknesses. Phalanx formations have been defeated numerous times by commanders who exploited its weaknesses.
The problem though is that Obama/Rahm/Reid don’t understand they are at war. They think they are engaged in a cooperative effort to help America’s corporations.
I see your point A1 and I agree but I believe reconciliation takes time and Democrats desperately need to move on to something else.
They think they are engaged in a cooperative effort to help America’s corporations.
I don’t quite agree with that statement. I think Obama was really making an effort to get everyone with a stake at the table. I don’t think anyone really anticipated that Republicans would go completely insane. But Democrats should know better now.
I think making Republicans talk hurts them.
There is one person in America who has the power in his hands to make Republicans talk about their wacky theories for weeks on end – Harry Reid.
it’s always darkest right before the dawn.
Maybe the dem’s should show some balls and tie up Brown like the repuk’s did to Al Frankin
U.I. wrote: “I don’t think anyone really anticipated that Republicans would go completely insane.”
Really? They have been insane for 40 years!
I think Obama was really making an effort to get everyone with a stake at the table.
The pro-forma effort was completed last summer and was rejected. Republican leadership went on record as being unwilling to participate except as obstructionists.
And – Why exactly should insurance and pharma have a seat at the table?
I don’t think anyone really anticipated that Republicans would go completely insane.
(claws out chunks of hair) We have known for a long time there is no depravity Republicans will not employ. Not knowing is simply naive.
Prophet without honor John Edwards:
Be glad we got this message in advance of the 2010 elections!
As UI said, we need to move on immediately to address jobs and the economy, getting past health care by getting the House to vote for the Senate Bill, then going through the reconciliation process.
The reconciliation process requires only 51 votes to get the bill to Obama, but it will be seriously watered down by enabling the Repubs to employ the Byrd rule (scroll down) to remove all provisions not related to spending and revenue matters, like eliminating exchanges, preexisting conditions and being arbitrarily dropped, like mandating insurance coverage, …. Such removal can only be overturned by a 60 vote super-majority. Certainly we can campaign against the Repubs on whatever important provisions they have removed.
The nation will be in better shape, and so will we Dems, come November if we succeed in helping Main Street by turning job loss to significant growth, and by accelerating mortgage forclosure remediation to keep people in their homes.
Screw the obstructionist Repubs; let us plunge ahead with what political capital we have left to tackle the problems that are at the heart of an aching America.
The Byrd Rule comes into play only if the spending would increase the deficit. This is why the CBO scorings were so important when the bills were being written. It is pretty arcane so I could be wrong, but I think that is the gist of it.
I can tell we’ll need to start studying reconciliation. I think Perry’s right that the the regulations can’t be passed by reconciliation, that’s why the House needs to pass the Senate bill. The public option certainly could be passed by reconciliation but it would sunset, just like Bush’s tax cuts.
My advice – don’t panic. Which will probably fall on deaf ears.
Last night’s defeat hit hard, in large part, to its symbolism. And yeah, that hurts. Republicans are riding high (and I don’t blame them), but victory can cause carelessness. On the flip side, losing can cause retreat. There are lessons to be learned from last night, and more than enough blame to go around. Personally, I got that out of my system last night and intend to keep moving on.
60 votes in the senate turned out to be a huge albatross around our necks – and there’s plenty of reasons for that. I’m growing comfortable with 59, mainly because it forces everyone into the fight – including Republicans, who can no longer sit on the sidelines, voting “no” while pointing out that with 60 votes Dems don’t need them. Which was true.
But the win last night changes that dynamic, and that 41st vote, while symbolic for Republicans, also forces them out of the stands and onto the field.
The public option certainly could be passed by reconciliation but it would sunset, just like Bush’s tax cuts.
I am not sure this is true. I think this is why the House bill got sent back to CBO so many times, to keep it deficit-neutral. If some funding in the bill gets stripped, then maybe the Byrd Rule comes into play.
But even a sunsetted public option would be fine with me. I would be happy to be running against Repubs in 2020 who want to take away health care.
Heck, if we pass a public option there might not even BE Republicans in 2020.
It is a huge failure on Obama/Rahm/Reid’s part that they couldn’t pick off a handful of Republican senators to break filibusters. Now maybe they will get serious about it.
Howard Dean: “Bush would have had healthcare a long time ago”
“We’ve got to be tougher,” Dean quipped. “I’ve said the Democrats are not tough enough. Bush would have had the health care bill done a long time ago. He would have gone through reconciliation.”
Under reconciliation, Democrats can move to pass parts of their healthcare reform bill with a simple fifty vote majority, evading the need for a 60-vote filibuster-proof supermajority. Liberals lost their sixtieth vote with the defeat of state attorney general Martha Coakley in Massachusetts to Republican Scott Brown.
Brown has promised to vote against a healthcare reform bill. The bill has passed both chambers of Congress but would need to pass both again after the House and Senate versions are combined.
Some Democrats have proposed a House-only vote on the Senate’s version of the bill, which would obviate the need for it to pass the Senate again. But House Democratic leadership seems reluctant to take up the idea anytime soon.
Dean says Obama should start by simply proposing a bill that allows all Americans over 55 to buy into Medicare. Such a bill could be passed through the Senate with 50 votes, a margin the Democrats can easily muster.
There’s not much “real” reform in the Senate bill either way, Dean said.”
More at:
http://rawstory.com/2010/01/dean-bush-healthcare-long-time/
Ummm…
They could barely get 60 Democrats to do this, why would Republicans be any different. Also, if Republicans were on board I think the bill would be a lot worse than it is now.
They could barely get 60 Democrats to do this, why would Republicans be any different.
Finding and exploiting weaknesses among Republican senators should be a lot easier than herding Democratic cats. But to win you have to play.
The democrats….. actually no. Progressives really need a Rush Limbaugh. we need an unscrupulous ass hole who isn’t afraid to tell outragous lies to advance our agenda. We also need a Karl Rove. A1 said something in some post about missing Howard Dean. I TOTALLY agree. it’s time to act like we are the party that only has 41 senators. We might as well…. we are able to get the same amount accomplished with these obstructionist american taliban around….
And it is going to be a tough fight. We can count on losing Delaware… has Beau even officially announced he is running? It is about that time.
Get real. Rush Limbaugh wasn’t necessary to pull Republican politicians to the right; they were already there, for the most part. Let’s face it, Democratic voters are to the left of Democratic politicians. Obama’s problem is that Congress is full of people who are Republicans in Democratic clothing.
oh i disagree. his droves of sheep do whatever he tells them. We dont have ANYONE with anything CLOSE to his audience.
We dont have ANYONE with anything CLOSE to his audience.
Well, we DO have a President…
We need someone who speaks populist, with bite and humor. Like Barney Frank on a good day. Actually we need a lot of them. And we don’t need them working for entertainment companies; we need them in Congress.
The Progressive Caucus should step up and start forcing bills to the left. Whatever happened to their pledge to vote against HCR that didn’t have a public option? Anthony Weiner is still making noises that way, but left himself plenty of wiggle room to vote for the Senate bill.
Dems need to stop being afraid of barking Republicans and realize there is NO PENALTY for passing progressive legislation. Passing a public option or raising taxes on the rich is a proud accomplishment to run on.
To whoever upthread asked, YES I miss Howard Dean.
Sorry, I can’t stomach the idea of having a Dem version of Limbaugh and Rove. Instead, the Howard Dean approach about being tough, for a change, would be just great!
We need to refocus intensely on Main Street, job creation, mortgage foreclosure remediation, loans to small businesses, help for state budget problems which, if successful, should be reflected favorably come November.
And yes, anon, focus on raising taxes on the rich as well!
UI and Pandora-You have both spoken w/ maturity and clarity on this loss. I would disagree though w/ the “wedge issues” piece though because we have all seen them turn into amalgam, when asked to act. What I think is the unaddressed concern of any party is the nanosecond attention span of the voter today. The average voter, though vested, has no patience, interest or long view in ANY legislation that needs monumental research, debate and dialogue. Everything must be a quick fix, or as you have seen it is a quick fry.
Apart from what no doubt you hear of this seat being bequeathed to the Dems, until the reading of the will–I definitely got the sense, that many eyes were opened to a Limousine Liberal, instead of a public servant. Hold the tomatoes–it may not be true–but not every voter can be up and personal, when news reports and followings show something else. IMHO w/ no axe to grind.
No I think you’re right Joanne, that voters saw a Limousine Liberal whether or not that was true. She didn’t go to ask voters for their vote, that was her big problem.
I’m with Perry. Democrats need to find another road besides another Limbaugh.
Democrats better make a course change immediately. If Mass can deliver a Teabagger, homophobe,sexist to replace Kennedy, the country is in trouble.
First of all, Mass rejected the Senate health care bill,they have been living under since Romney was the Guv. The Mass legislature voted for single payer health care and lost by one vote. Mass have the highest insurance rates in the country. By their vote yesterday, they will force the democrats to adopt the public option and the House version. If the Congress/Senate are stupid enough to continue to push the Senate version we will see more and more teabaggin morons elected. The Republicans are the best as messaging, they have no real solutions to our problems but Brown used the “economy” against the democrats (as if the democrats are solely responsible for the horrible economy). The voters are sick and tired of the bankster bailouts and sent a strong message to the Democratic Party. Change course and give us he hope and change we voted for or we will continue our voter revolt.
Get me a radio show – you know I’m not afraid to say anything that will piss people off. 😉
While I agree that Dems need a new approach, I’m not seeing what happened in Massachusetts as a rejection of health care, or that Mass. was looking for someone to get rid of what they had. In fact, Brown went out of his way to praise what Mass. had compared to the rest of the country. So while he ran on stopping the Obama/Congress plan, he never ran on repealing what his state has.
Which is an interesting road map for those interested in following it. Despite Massachusetts’ problems with their less than perfect health care, no one is campaigning on taking it away.
I’m sure Bill Colley would welcome having you sit in or call in to give the progressive viewpoint.
“a Teabagger, homophobe,sexist ”
it may have escaped your notice but your epithets have lost there currency with the voters. or is this just libtard turrets?
as Lanny Davis pointed out, It’s The Corruption Stupid!
tax on health insurance for everybody but your union buddies
the Nebraska pay off
the Louisiana pay off
it really doesnt matter what it was. The media will paint it as a rejection of Obama, health care, and all democrats for the rest of time. Democrats simply do not have the spin machine the republicans have. This country is full of sheep. I have to say, Obama herded many of those sheep (independents) but they are all so dumb, they were able to be swayed by CONSTANT lies from Fixed and neutered reporting from every other news outlet. The democrats NEED a Karl Rove.
pandora, you might see it as a rejection of the current fake HCR bill, though.
Despite the election’s bad results for Democrats the Delaware GOP will not benefit at all. They still cling to the genetic wisdom of flawed duPonts like Copeland even though he gave up a safe senate seat to join Bill Lee and then get slapped around by Denn. Not to mention the 20 employees business whiz Copeland has laid off.
The Delaware GOP is the ultimate circular firing squad who try to maintain the facade of being in charge while they ignore realities.
Tom Loss aka Tom Ross and others don’t get it.
When will they embrace a non elitist Republican who likes unions, favors universal health care, favors drug treatment and is skeptical of corporate america?
Not likely too soon. Let’s hope the Mass election wakes them up a bit. Brown was a normal guy not a whack job.
Get me a radio show – you know I’m not afraid to say anything that will piss people off.
MJ any moron can piss people off, the secret to success is getting them to tune in and listen.
as for getting a radio show, that’s easy, you buy the time. you pay for it by either selling commercals on you block of time or donation fundraising to pay for it.
I get a good laugh everyday when Lizard/Gecko/Crazy Ellen doesn’t recognize sarcasm.
Oh, and thank you for letting us all know what we’ve suspected for a long time – you really are a moron.
The overall problem we face is the Senate filibuster, the Republican ax.
Regardless, we need to generate the legislation to solve the problems already listed, then hold the Repubs accountable in the election campaign for every obstructive action they commit.
Moreover, we will have to reinvigorate the grass roots again, to the extent possible.
The blame for our problems and for the lack of solutions, has to be placed into the laps of the do-nothing/no-nothing Repubs.
It’s going to be a real battle!
In effect we are being made the victims by the Republicans of the high expectations that Obama has set. Let us, however, not abandon them, rather continue to promote them with continued legislative actions to do so.
Voters have to be helped to understand that the problems the Dems inherited from the Repubs are so serious, that to expect complete resolution in too short a time is too much to expect. Nevertheless, we need to show significant progress toward solutions, like turning around the negative trends in jobs, foreclosures, and loans to small businesses.
It is ironic that the Republicans largely created these historically huge problems, yet Obama and the Dems are getting the blame right now. This is a messaging challenge for the Dems; we have to do better with our messaging, a strength of Obama’s.
In spite of everything, Obama is still popular, so his presentation of progressive accomplishments and Republican obstructions will be important in this upcoming campaign.