Ya Think?
The release of the fake David Koch/Scott Walker tapes has been the best thing that could have happened for the progressive movement. Labor unions had already been doing the hard work of showing solidarity against the power grab of Scott Walker. Before the recording was released, the selling of our government to big money interests got barely a thought from most people. The recording changed that. Not only did it show that Governor Walker could find 20 minutes to talk to an out-of-state billionaire (while not talking to actual Democratic state legislators), he admitted on tape that his goal was to break the unions. One really troubling part of the recording got very little play on the news – the part where Walker admits he had considered planting agitators in the crowd. Apparently not everyone ignored this part:
Well, here’s one person who finds this disturbing: The police chief in Madison, Wisconsin. The Journal Sentinel reports:
Madison Police Chief Noble Wray said Thursday that he found comments by Gov. Scott Walker made about protesters at the state Capitol during a prank phone call “very unsettling and troubling.”
In a statement, Wray said he spent time overnight thinking about the comments Walker made during a 20-minute conversation with a Buffalo N.Y. blogger who posed as a major Republican donor during the call…
Wray said he was disturbed that Walker thought about planting troublemakers among peaceful protesters.
“I would like to hear more of an explanation from Governor Walker as to what exactly was being considered, and to what degree it was discussed by his cabinet members. I find it very unsettling and troubling that anyone would consider creating safety risks for our citizens and law enforcement officers,” the chief said.
The blase reaction by some in the press to this quote was a bit surprising, but that seems to have turned around a bit today. MSNBC has been pushing the quote hard, and more broadly, the big news orgs have been in effect portraying Walker as a bit of a national joke: “Governor punk’d.”
Despite all the people who said nothing to see, move along, the recording continues to be a big problem for Governor Walker. The recordings led the evening news, and all but one of the questions at Walker’s press conference were about the Koch conversation. Walker may win this battle, but he brought on a war.
Tags: Cheddar Revolution, Scott Walker, Unions, Wisconsin
I’m speaking with a Wisconsinite on my new podcast “Delaware Undiluted” tonight. It should be posted around 5:00 or so. If you have anything that you are curious about and want to ask someone who has been on the state capital grounds for the past week, leave a comment on this thread.
The questions I would ask are the following:
How is this being played in the local media – are they representing this as a budget problem or as union busting?
What’s the local opinion on the Senate Dems fleeing the state?
How much attention is being given to the fake Koch call?
What is the likelihood of recall elections occurring?
Oh Mother Mary, those are good. Since madison is also the State’s big university town, I was also going to ask how he thinks people outside of Madison are viewing this.
Tell us your anecdotes and experiences of the election. Walker won with about 52% (70K votes). Was there an “enthusiasm gap” that had any effect on Wisconsin Democrats? If so, why?
At the time of the election, were public employees as motivated as they are now? Were they aware of the consequences of the election as we are seeing them now?
Are you or any of your friends among the Americans who criticize Obama from the left (to any degree)?
I hope your Wisconsin friend doesn’t jump onto this thread and spoil your podcast 🙂
Phil Bannowsky writes:
Save the American Dream Rally
The State House, Dover, DE Saturday, 26 Feb 2011, 12:00 PM
Please join us in support of the American worker, on Saturday, Feb 26 in front of the Legislative Hall, on Leg. Mall, in Dover, DE. Government officials throughout this country who were elected by the Tea Party are attacking the middle class. We must stand together to stop this destructive behavior. Remember, for the forces of evil to succeed, all is required is for enough good men to do nothing.
For more info, see http://pol.moveon.org/event/events/attendees/index.html?id=-8032877-kCBoBKx&event_id=112833
Sending in agitators, unfortunately, has been done by the police before. In denver, undercover cops got caught trying to instigate violence at the 2004 republican convention. They also got caught in NY at the 2008 democratic convention.
I hate hearing about the tea party anymore. It has absolutely nothing in common with the grassroots protests that started years ago. They should just change it to the tea-ocon party. Nothing but neocon rhetoric now. Kinda sad really. This is just more of the same with nifty name change now.
Ask your ‘token’ Wisconsonite pro-union guest if he/she is embarrassed by the over-the-top vulgar, racist, homophobic and violent messaging emanating from Madison.
http://michellemalkin.com/2011/02/25/hate-a-rama-the-vulgar-racist-sexist-homophobic-rage-of-the-left/
I can’t wait to get some video footage of the MoveOn.org and SEIU thugacrats this Saturday. I think it will, once and for all, crystalize the overwhelmingly pissed off non-union majority in this country to levels unseen since the days of Walter Reuther.
Newsflash: This budget repair bill has nothing to do with Wall Street, the Koch Bros, inalienable rights or union-busting.
It has to do with reality. To wit: Public-sector unions have the strongest and most comprehensive Civil Service laws in the U.S.; they are a cartel; they work for the taxpayer’s, not for their own monopolistic fiefdom; they are extraordinarily inflexible; they bully politicians who don’t kow-tow to their demands; they live by a ‘double-standard vis-a-vis private sector workers; they contribute nearly all of the political funds collected from union dues and direct those monies to 98.5 percent of Democratic candidates each election cycle (whether the union worker wants his or her money to go to liberal causes or not) and they don’t care if their position towards management (i.e., the taxpayers) is death-by-a-thousand-cuts or not.
This is 2011, not 1911. Collective bargaining in public-sector unions is anachronistic. Weekends and 8-hour work days aren’t going anywhere. Overtime rules are covered by federal law as is thousands of other laws that protect workers and citizens alike from unscrupulous owners.
The “Y’s” emanating from those who believe they are special and/or entitled to more than what reality allows to be reconciled is profligate (hypocrisy, duplicity, acrimony, monopoly and inflexibility).
Well newshound I know in most labor unions at the local level, all political donations come from PAC accounts not the general fund. The PAC dues are voluntary, and do not come from standard dues. Now national and international dues is another story.
The problem I have is the total lack of debate or comprimise. They have said they are willing to take the financial cuts to keep their barganing rights.
Newshound = House slave
Of course it was inevitable that either Geezer or socialist ben would attack me for my POV on this very important topic.
And his comment “Newshound = House slave” is exactly the type of rhetoric that I expect to see at the union solidarity rallies this Saturday.
Aside from the myriad Republican governors across the nation confronting head-on the budgetary woes in their respective statehouses, it’s somehow ironically funny how Dem governors, mayors and county executives are trying to do sort-of the same thing as Gov. Walker in Wisconsin is doing – only most of these stories are ‘under-the-radar.’
Even Paul Clark, Gerry Brown, Cuomo in NY and other “D’s” are trying to rein in the ridiculous promises made by previous politicians that are detached from economic and social reality.
Heck, just this afternoon, a gagle of Democratic Governors took a field trip to the White House to speak with Obama and ask him to please help with their budget woes (state bailouts?). Moreover, the majority of the “D” governors want to get tacit approval so they can ratchet back many of the union giveaways that have weighed down their respective budget problems. Priceless!
I would love to be a fly on the wall when Rahm Emanuel reponds in private to the upcoming screams of injustice that will unltimately be hurled at him once he has to confront Chicago’s massive budget hole! And if you thought Rahm’s “You guys are a bunch of F#$&!$@ Retards!” missive he spouted in his office at the White House during a closed-door meeting with progressive strategists back in ’09 was harsh… 😉
Newshound =I’s got mine, you get yours.
It’s a narrow focus of one. It was disgusting in the days of slavery and it’s as disgusting now as the TEA-PEOPLE pick up and promote this mantra.
The Plantation owners seem to be moving North inexorably.They must be stopped.Quite frankly, they must have been jailed long ago.
Btw, Wisconsin’s Journal Sentinal makes the News Journal look like the Washington Times.
You’ll see that rhetoric because it’s the truth. Rather than address the increasing lopsidedness of the country’s distribution of resources, you prefer to continue our 30-year trend of taking from the middle class to give to the upper classes.
The fact that Democrats as well as Republicans are catering to the rich does not prove it’s a good idea or even necessary. The fact that you approve of it shows that you hope ol’ massa will give you the best crumbs from the big house table.
Your next “original thought” will be your first.
” Rather than address the increasing lopsidedness of the country’s distribution of resources, you prefer to continue our 30-year trend of taking from the middle class to give to the upper classes.”
Are you dense? nobody is taking from the middle class; the taxpayers of Wisconsin provide the means to the public-sector workers. The money comes from mostly other lower or middle class people! Hello?
Lopsidedness? The average Wisconsin teacher in Milwaukee, for example, earns about $100k with benefits, according to a Wisconsin state department study. The average PS worker in Wisc. as a whole avrages around $76k with benefits. The private sector workers in Wisc. earn around $50k on average with benefits.
Why do you think that when the dust settles in and around Madison’s Capitol Building, and the Fleebagger State Senators pull up their soiled and damp Huggie’s and come out of hiding and return to do their job, will you see a ground swell of support for Gov. Scott Walker from the majority of people who voted for him.
As defrocked Nancy Pelosi once said in regards to the grassroots Tea Party crowd, “it’s simply Astroturf.” Take away the bussed-in union thugocrats in Wisconsin’s capital and you’d start to see something that more resembles indoor-outdoor carpeting.
Well your 100K figure comes from Milwaukee, where the average salary was 64K/year (not counting benefits), but the average salary in Price County, the lowest paid county, is 22K/year. so I’m not sure how applicable your figures are to any semblance of reality.
“The fact that you approve of it shows that you hope ol’ massa will give you the best crumbs from the big house table.”
That’s an important insight, Geezer. I suspect that’s a big reason why many working class Americans vote against their best interests. They believe the Ol’ massa will give them a pay off (witness the right wing fallacious mantra “Don’t increase the personal income taxes of the class that creates jobs.”). I wish I could find the polling, but I once read a poll indicating that a large percentage of Americans believe they will end up in the top 10% of wage earners. The ol’ massa is great at indoctrinating the public, across many venues, in the delusion that they too will have a seat at the banquet table.
Someone please explain to me why it would be bad of teachers really earned $100K per year?
NH, for someone who claims to be an idependent thinker, you sure do type the latest RWNJ talking points a lot.
If we really cared about our childrens education we should be supporting paying teachers more! Why do so many teachers leave teaching and enter other professions, cuz they have to live like paupers.
Excellent point, UI. Everyone talks about following the Finnish model of public education, which has been rated as having the best public educational system in the world. But what rarely gets related is that Finnish public school teachers are among the most highest paid employees in Finland, they are 100% unionized, and they have contract negotiation rights. If anyone thinks those factors aren’t integral to their educational outcomes, they are dreaming.
Indeed, I think teachers should be paid far more then they are. Yet, because of antiquated rules, the bad teachers (mostly the tenured, don’t care about really teaching and inspiring young minds).
That’s why it’s a farce to not see teachers jump at the opportunity for merit pay when governors offer it up; to see teachers fight Charter schools and for teachers to not want to give up the ‘tenure’ protection. Besides associate and full professors, who in the world gets to have a job where after 2 – 3 years, you’re in no matter how good or bad your performance is? We all know it’s virtually impossible to remove a horrible teacher. The best teachers see this problem and they hate it.
In the private sector, there are always workers who excel at their job. They see how many other workers are slackers. Ultimately, morale suffers when this scenario exists. But unlike in the public sector, the ‘bad’ worker generally gets fired. Conversely, the bad teachers in public schools remain until they either commit some heinous crime or they become Bi-Polar or something, even then, they get called back by the union and oftentimes get backpay.
Did you ever see Waiting for Superman?
Again, the best (public school)teachers should make between $90k and $120k, IMHO.
You can have exactly that newshound while still having unions. In my union, if you underperfom, you are the first one on the chopping block. Employers also have the right of refusal. That means if you have a reputation of being a bad worker, they can refuse to take you.
Also, the union pay is the minimum. If you are an examplary worker, you can get paid more.
“the taxpayers of Wisconsin provide the means to the public-sector workers. The money comes from mostly other lower or middle class people! Hello?”
You are the one who is dense. Gov. Walker’s proposals will save the state $30 million. In a state of just under 5.7 million, that’s less than $6 per person on average. Leaving aside whether the benefits are “fair,” that means you are willing to sell out fellow members of the middle class for the price of a sandwich.
But that’s not the full story. Wisconsin’s income tax rates are more graduated than Delaware’s. Above $20K the rate is 6.5%; above 153K it’s 6.75%; above 225K it’s 7.75%. So the upper classes will pay a bit more than $6 per person, while the middle classes will pay a bit less.
Now, to whether such benefits are “fair”: When I took a private-sector job in 1980, my medium-sized employer paid 100% of my medical benefits and provided a defined-benefit pension that vested after five years of employment. I don’t know your age, but my point is that the benefits your sort now considers outrageous were in fact normal until the election of Ronald Reagan.
In the intervening 30 years, those benefits have been systematically dismantled for middle-class workers without union protection (but often not for the upper-class workers, who typically are provided more lucrative benefit packages). Yet you choose to resent not the upper classes, who set the rules for themselves (just like the politicians your sort so easily resents), but rather your fellow members of the middle class whose unions protected those benefits, usually by trading away higher pay increases.
The “averages” you cite have been handed to you by ol’ massa. The average private sector worker does not have the education level of the average teacher — far below it, in fact. And, of course, averages tell us next to nothing of the truth about those living in the big house on the plantation.
For that picture, go to the scoreboard: By every measure, the middle class in this country has stagnated for 30 years while the share of wealth in the hands of the upper 5%, 2%, 1% and .1% has soared. Yet you are willing to fight not the oligarchs who set the rules and then propagandize that they have “earned” their riches, but those in the middle class who have slightly more than you. You are willing to buy the fiction peddled by Gov. Christie — that because both you and the rich person pay taxes, you and the rich person are brothers, and you are both at war with the people serving the public, who, he claims, have “rich benefits.”
We are at class war, Newshound, and you have chosen your side. You have internalized the propaganda that the way to a better life is to compete, compete, compete in a Hobbesian world that, supposedly, is the apotheosis of “freedom.” Open your eyes and see that the true way to protect yourself is by banding together against the rapacious forces of unbridled capitalism.
You are either with us or against us.
In the private sector, there are always workers who excel at their job. They see how many other workers are slackers. Ultimately, morale suffers when this scenario exists. But unlike in the public sector, the ‘bad’ worker generally gets fired.
This may be the funniest thing I’ve ever read.
@Geezer “… that because both you and the rich person pay taxes, you and the rich person are brothers, and you are both at war with the people serving the public.”
No. Wrong. Even though I belong to no union, I stand with the public unions. I fully understand that when the unions are broken, that nearly ALL jobs will have lower wages and benefits.
Those ex-union guys will start to compete for YOUR job, and YOUR company can pay one of you less, and still get the job done.
And THAT is why PRIVATE corporate executives want so much to break the PUBLIC sector unions.