Oregon and the End of Democracy
The Oregon state house passed a climate change bill that the Oregon Senate didn’t have the votes to defeat. So the GOP Senators left the capitol to deny a quorum.
The Governor said that he would send the state police to find the anti-democracy GOP Senators and return them to the capitol.
A least one anti-democracy GOP Senator said that he is armed and would shoot to kill if the State Police tried to make him a “political prisoner.”
Anti-Democracy militia groups expressed support for the anti-democracy Senator and promised violence against the state police and the state legislature. Some anti-democracy militia groups gathered at the state Capitol.
State police deemed the safety of lawmakers was threatened, so the Oregon state Senate cancelled its Saturday session.
Agreed, the Republicans grow ever more anti democracy and openly flout the rule of law, goes well with their love of voter suppression and gerrymandering. As for the militia groups their usually of the “white power” variety as well. Suggest Oregon do what the Republicans in the south would do and call out the National Guard.
Jason, your story here is kind of disingenuous. From CBS news: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/oregon-republicans-climate-change-bill-lawmakers-walk-out-of-state-legislature-as-governor-orders-police-round-up/
“The minority GOP caucus wants the plan to be sent to voters instead of being instituted by lawmakers — but negotiations with Democrats collapsed, leading to a headline-grabbing walkout.”
Cap and Trade is the issue and its effects on the citizens of the state whether it be costs bled down to businesses, power prices, regulations, on and on. Cap and Trade isn’t the way go to about it.
All in all, what voters say and want about an issue is the basis of a democracy. (Actually, we are a republic, completely different, but who really cares? Certainly no one on this blog understands the concepts.)
We live, as you note, in a series of republics, local, state and federal. What the GOP is demanding here is a referendum because they lost the elections. This is known as “forum shopping,” and it would work here because nobody wants higher taxes.
Better get used to paying higher prices for carbon. And, just BTW, for the gratuitous insult, go fuck yourself.
Beat me to it.
And FWIW, what part of that CBS link says that in a republic the minority caucus is empowered to murder state troopers who are simply trying to perform their legal duties?
Fucking whiny-ass tittie babies, all of them.
The C stands for Concept Understander
I’m not exactly endorsing the tactic in this case, but I seem to remember Democratic Senators fleeing the state a decade ago when the Republicans were forcing an early re-districting/gerrymandering down their throats.
I was supportive of it at the time because it seemed like their only recourse to combat a clearly underhanded move by their opponents. At some point don’t we have to allow for the minority in any elected body to pull the emergency cord and make a stand so long as that stand doesn’t directly flout the will of the voters?
No.
Ballots are the rightful and peaceful successors of bullets, and that when ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
The stand I was referring to was fleeing to prevent a quorum, not shooting anyone. But just so I’m clear, this means you were similarly opposed to the Democrats in Texas efforts to prevent an early re-districting by fleeing as well?
“Early redistricting” is another term for “changing the rules so we can cheat.”
Nothing of the sort is being done in Oregon. In Oregon you have revanchist pieces of shit — oh, I’m sorry, white people — who want violence.
YMMV. But there’s a word for people who insist on logical consistency in a viper pit — fool. It’s why Democrats always lose. They will accuse you of hypocrisy no matter what, and always remember, they want to use their guns on us.
Yeah. With everything we now know, you’d have to be pretty weak-minded (or disingenuous) to trot out the hoary chestnut “But, but, but, Democrats did something once” argument in 2019.
Let me first say that I don’t know everything you know. That’s why I check in here. And you can decide for yourself how weak-minded I am but disingenuous won’t stick. I’m not interested in playing the “what about them?” game. But I feel like an article that condemns a tactic that has proven to be necessary and effective for one side is far too easily dismissed if it doesn’t draw a contrast with how and why it was used by the other side.
I won’t accuse you of being disingenuous in return. I’ve read enough of your posts to want to see your side and be supportive of it. And maybe you don’t care to make your case in a convincing manner to someone who wants to understand. Or maybe you just don’t want to do it here on this blog. But when half the posts I read seem to take a stand on an issue or a piece of legislation based on its merits and the justice and equality they promote or destroy …. and then the other half just boil down to it’s right when our side does it – that sucks for me. Because then I can’t get on board no matter how much I’d like to.
Early-redistricting = cheating. I agree. Exactly why I was supportive of Texas Democrats fleeing to prevent a quorum.
I’m not in a position to insist on anything. And neither is anyone here or we wouldn’t all be bitching about our government. But I’ll keep clinging to whatever scrap of consistency I can. Without it all I’d be left with is tribalism. And I have being a Flyers fan to check that box.
“And maybe you don’t care to make your case in a convincing manner to someone who wants to understand.”
Maybe you are a true unicorn then. You are neither disingenuous nor weak-minded. But I’ve just heard “Democrats did something once” so often by so many disingenuous Republican fuckers that I’m done with it.
Maybe I’m wrong though, and you come by your desire for consistency honestly, but I doubt it.
I’m registered as a Democrat but I can’t say I’m happy about it or proud of that fact. But I’m sure as fuck not a Republican. Maybe someday I’ll get invited to the bunker and you can reassess.
Until then all I ask is that you give me the benefit of the doubt and make the case for me when I ask a question. After you do, feel free to going back to telling me how uninformed I am. I promise not to claim otherwise.
Alby is correct. Tactics depend on context. Material conditions. Nothing is first order. Hagel didn’t go far enough. Dialectics.
These mistakes are rampant because we don’t teach Marx is schools.
Re MFX comment. I ain’t mad. Like i said, I understand that he point . I this people would have a better perspective if they read Marx. I’m not being cynical.
You seem like a good faith actor. Plus you’re a patron of Delaware’s foremost political podcast. You’re good in my book.
^like^
@Jason: No, the problem is that Democrats insist on holding the “moral high ground,” apparently for reasons of psychological self-protection. Democrats try to be “good people.” Republicans just act however they want and insist that they are “good people” anyway.
Look around you to see which method wins and which one loses.
Could someone start a new post on this one for me? I need someone to help me understand WTF even happened in this case. So the Republican Senators who went with the nuclear option and fled the state to prevent a quorum came back to work BEFORE the session was over and it still got killed with a 17-10 vote to go back to committee? They didn’t even have the fucking votes but they still ran? And now the Republicans are claiming victory? I’m lost.
Withouth even looking up an update it is easy to predict that the Republicans are “claiming victory”. That’s Republicansism 101. Always claim victory.
That said, they have this thing now called “google”. It allows you to search all the newspapers in the world on your personal computer. If you enter something like “oregon senate” in the google tool, you can probably find some updates.
You’re welcome.
Based on the fact that I live here in Delaware and I stated a few facts about what just happened on the other side of the country it would seem obvious that I already used your fancy Google machine. But thanks for being a dick about it anyway.
Three articles later all I had were the facts listed above and I was hoping for some interpretation of what happened and some opinions. You know, blog stuff. Discussion. Rumor has it that’s what you folks do around here. And El Som in particular has been very helpful in breaking things down for me in the past and clueing me in to behind the scenes machinations that aren’t included in the basic reporting.
But message received. Henceforth I will no longer ask questions or participate. Please accept my apologies for any disturbance I caused with my questions and engagement.
Your best bet for more detail is to look up the Oregon-based newspapers.
Many comments here seem to be ignoring the main thrust of the story: the endorsement of violence by Republican representatives and the allying with paramilitary groups to prevent a vote from going forward.
We could argue about the tactics of leaving the state (it’s a bit campy but I don’t mind it) or the benefits of cap and trade (I’m more of a carbon dividend guy myself) but this is about more than that. Now, I don’t think this specific event killed democracy or anything, but if it becomes a more common tactic, that’s bad news. If we want more referendums on big votes, I’m all for it, but the way to do that is not through threats of fascist violence.
https://www.wweek.com/news/state/2019/06/21/oregon-senate-cancels-saturday-session-amid-reports-of-militia-groups-protesting-at-capitol/