DL Open Thread Sunday, Sept. 24, 2023
More evidence that once the fetus is out he’s on his own: Texas’ razor-wired Rio Grande has claimed three more victims, one of them a 3-year-old.
The Rude Pundit nails it, as usual: Republicans don’t stand up to Trump because, tough guys that they are, they’re a-skeered of his violent followers. Still won’t lock them in the padded rooms they deserve, though, because they need their votes, given that nobody else will vote for them.
While we all laugh at Lauren Boebert’s Roman hands and Russian fingers, Amanda Marcotte notes that she’s a perfect example of what happens when women follow the marry ’em young and breed ’em quick philosophy conservatives hold so dear.
Humans think they’re all that, but archaeologists have discovered a wooden structure that’s half a million years old, meaning it predates homo sapiens.
The floor’s yours.
End the suffering with a modern compromise:
Asylum seekers/refugees are welcome to live and work in the US, provided that there is an end to birthright citizenship. Neither they nor their children would be eligible to become citizens without exiting the US for a period of 5 years before starting the naturalization process
We don’t know the details of the many compromises that have been floated over the years, so who knows if the hard-liners have already rejected this? But it wouldn’t work for the simple reason that asylum seekers are here precisely because it’s too dangerous to stay where they were, so making them leave for 5 years isn’t a viable solution.
From the stuff I’ve read (admittedly not a great deal), RWNJs are all worked up about the future demographics of the country rather than the “immigrants are taking our jobs” fears of years past. This “thinking” is also behind the abortion bans.
Not that this would satisfy them, either, but making it a 10-year process instead of a 5-year one might assuage their fears that Democrats only want to let in immigrants so they can vote against Republicans.
Under this arrangement, asylum seekers can stay as long as they want; they just wont have political power until they exit for a period of time and then return to apply for citizenship. Chances are, many will relocate to canada or elsewhere with more generous social welfare cultures.
I think there is a more nuanced take than “demographics”. I think it is about maintaining a political culture that its hard to replicate among desperate, needy people.
Yeah, still not going to work, but arguing the specifics of a proposal that won’t get any further than this discussion isn’t worth the effort.
Your second point is simply the way they legitimize their fear of a black planet. How are a couple of million immigrants going to change the political culture of a nation of 330 million people? Not that the political culture is all that great anyway, as I’m sure you’ve noticed.
“fear of a black planet” is a little hyperbolic. Enrique tarrio is a case study in the effective conversion of black and brown people into Maga chuds. This is about maintaining a pro-capitalist/anti-marxist political culture that is overwhelmingly christian.
If this discussion is merely pissing into the wind, thats fine by me.
I’m not in favor of maintaining a culture that’s pro-capitalist or pro-Christian. Capitalism got us here, it won’t get us out, and I’m against all religions.
I don’t care for pissing into the wind, and this isn’t a place for people to do that. If you’re looking for a debate, join a debating society.
Ending birthright citizenship requires a constitutional amendment. You’ll be on the side of the deplorables fighting for that one.
If the economy requires new immigrants (and it does) then the states should be advocating for more immigration and competing for the new immigrants. But we are seeing the opposite.
US employers don’t want immigrants with legal rights. They want an illegal labor pool they can exploit. And even employers who don’t hire illegally benefit from the illegal labor pool driving down wages.
The New Colossus (“Give me your tired, your poor….”) was written in 1883 when the frontier was still a thing, and half of workers worked in agriculture. Now in late-stage capitalism voters see the economy as a zero-sum game.
So what? Birthright citizenship was created to solve the problem that hasn’t existed since the end of the civil war. Good democratic policy should necessarily include the repeal of outdated laws.
The need for illegal, low-skill labor is decreasing by the day. What is holding back our economy are the lack of medium to high-skill workers like chemists, engineers, and electricians. We already have a surplus of code jockeys, landscapers, and policy wonks.
I agree that the the US is no longer a “physical” frontier economy – we can’t absorb the tired and poor like we had in the past. If voters see the economy as a zero-sum game, that’s a governmental problem that ties back to economic globalism of the NAFTA era
“The need for illegal, low-skill labor is decreasing by the day.”
No, it’s not. Low-skill service economy jobs require people, and those are the jobs that have increased the most.
And where do you get the notion that something is “holding back our economy”? Who do you think benefits from a booming economy? Check out wage growth vs. economic growth before you answer.
You mean stocking shelves at dollar tree? We are on the cusp of a major service economy collapse with robotics and AI.
I am part of the US economy full time (unlike yourself). We can find construction labor. We can’t find enough plumbers and engineers
Ever picked vegetables? No? Neither have most native-borns.
I’ve been hearing about this supposed service-economy collapse for years. It ain’t happening. Try looking up the numbers on the need for home health care aides.
What does my being retired have to do with anything? Insults won’t get you anything but kicked out.
“If the economy requires new immigrants (and it does)… ”
That’s the bottom line. Industrialized nations have low birth rates, and it’s not as if there’s some shortage of humans outside those nations.
The notion that people who want to leave dictatorships will come to the US so that they can bring those authoritarian values with them makes no sense, but a failure to make any sense is a feature, not a bug, for conservatives.
As research has shown, it’s their overactive amygdalas at work. I’m of the opinion that we fight against, not compromise with, illogical attitudes.
I admit it–had to look up ‘amygdalas’.
Was I the only one?