Senate passes Health Care Reform
Turn on your CNN or MSNBC to see this historic moment. Harry Reid is speaking now, so the vote is immiment. It will be interesting to see the final tally here. Will there be liberal Democrats that vote against final passage due to the lack of the public option? Will Lieberman vote against it
Final score: 60-39
No and No. The insurance companies get thie loot and we get the gate. American politics at it’s usual.
No matter what you think of the bill, this is a huge achievement. I would also tell progressives not to despair. You can tell we’re having an impact on the debate, especially all of the “we know it’s not perfect we’ll continue to work” promises. Harkin and Rockefeller are already working on a PO bill to be introduced next year and the House-Senate conference is looking to speed up benefits. I think this is just the 1st step on the road to real hcr reform and we should celebrate it (as long as we vow to keep working).
I would also state that Jane Hamsher working with Grover Norquist to push Fannie & Fredddie conspiracy theories is absolutely insane. WTF is she thinking?
No matter what you think of the bill, this is a huge achievement. No.
Our President is about to speak.
Hmm, could this be A1. 😉
Not a single Republican voted for it, and we hope to punish many of the Democrats who did at the polls next year. This will result in higher taxes, higher premiums for those who have insurance, and worse health care for everyone.
The actual provisions of the legislation don’t really matter. We don’t know what will be in the conference bill, and whatever does get passed will be changed over the course of time. The real problem is that we have now decided that the federal government is responsible for people’s health care, rather than individuals being responsible for themselves. Just one more bit of liberty taken away, one more bit of freedom gone.
Drug lobby applauds Senate passage of health-care bill
Washington Examiner ^
The Pharmaceutical Researchers and Manufacturers of America (PhRMA), is the largest single-industry lobbying group in America. It represents name-brand drug-makers. Considering this clout, and considering President Obama’s claim Monday that the Senate, by passing the health-care bill, was “standing up to the special interests,” it’s noteworthy that PhRMA this morning celebrated the bill’s passage.
You lack of support for healthcare reform will haunt Republicans for a generation, just like your refusal to vote for Social Security.
Republicans cast the right vote for the wrong reasons. Welcome to the United Corporations of America, where government has abrogated its responsibilities to serve its citizens and transferred them to corporations.
HCR 2009 = WMD 2002 Obama lies while reform dies.
Like Gene McCarthy endorsing Reagan, A1 = WATB
Sorry to feed the troll but this incomprehending absolutism is dangerous:
http://www.samefacts.com/2009/12/uncategorized/jane-hamsher-makes-it-official/
I guess that disagreements aren’t acceptable in your world, John. It was “group think” that lead this country into Iraq and it is “group think” that is leading the country to corporatism. I am sorry that you think expressing disagreement and engaging in the discussion is being a “troll” or expressing an opinion different than yours is “incomprehending absolutism.” But there you have it.
I will say that it is interesting to watch fellow liberals trying to delegitimize dissenting points of views, even when they share a common goal.
Thanks for the link, John. It unwittingly shows how corrupt your side of this argument is. For instance, take this sentence:
“The bailouts that prevented the Great Recession from turning into a second Depression were a bad idea, because some bank executives took home bonuses they didn’t deserve.”
Mocking through diminishment is a favorite tactic of all sophists, yourself (and this author you link to) included. No, as a matter of fact, the bailouts were a bad idea because we let the bank executives who had joined the government write the legislation, which therefore included no safeguards against this happening again. Just for the record, saving the economy = good; saving the system that led to the dysfunction = bad.
Since you can’t seem to comprehend the difference there, I’m not sure why you’re involved in this discussion at all — unless cheerleading for the DLC serves some purpose.
Two more perspectives on the Hamsher/Norquist alliance.
From dengre at Daily Kos, an expert on Jack Abramhoff.Grover Norquist is our ally? Are you f@ing kidding me!”
Note: not a DLC-er
From Jed Lewison, also at Daily Kos:
“Sheer Nonsense”
Teaming up with an enemy of progressives to push Vince Foster-like conspiracy theories is just plain dumb.
Hamsher has lost it. Really sad, because she did some great work on this issue.
Rule #1 – Never take politics personally.
she lost it alright, how could anyone criticise this:
Big paydays for Fannie and Freddie bosses (Million dollar bonuses for Execs at Mortgage Giants)
CNN Money ^ | 12/23/2009 | Chris Isidore
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) — Top executives at mortgage finance giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, both of which have been under government control since last year, received millions of dollars in pay in 2009, according to documents filed by the companies Thursday. The chief executive officers of each company got annual pay packages worth $6 million apiece, while other top execs pulled in at least $2 million. Fannie Mae (FNM, Fortune 500) CEO Michael Williams, who was promoted to CEO on April 21, will receive about $4.2 million in base salary and deferred cash payments for his time in the…
after all this was blessed by the Dear Leader’s Pay Czar.
Sorry, I can’t fault Jane Hamsher. I don’t know yet if I want to sign on, but I certainly understand. Rahm is the linchpin in the White House’s support for conservadems over progressives. He is a legitimate target for progressives now.
Wanna know what this story sounds like to the country? “Senate Passes Health Care Reform.” If people still go broke after getting sick, that’s bad news for the Dems. (Cuz you know who is going to be campaigning against the crappy dem reforms…That’s right, Tom Carper and maybe Beau Biden and Mike Castle.) For now it is a win.
May the peace of Sky Dad be on y’alls tonight and in the new year.
How is this not the ultimate description of fascist corporatism? Is there not a more perfect embodiment of that term than 2009 America?
“… the bailouts were a bad idea because we let the bank executives …”
Krugman understands.
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/29/bailout-questions-answered/
“The real problem is that we have now decided that the federal government is responsible for people’s health care, rather than individuals being responsible for themselves.”
I have a relative who was diagnosed with cancer. His insurance company’s response was to drop his coverage. How exactly is that an individual being responsible for his own health care? I thought you wanted people and their doctors making medical decisions, not bureaucrats. The only difference is that the bureaucrat who made this decision works for the insurance company, not the government.
This bill isn’t perfect, but the least you can do is be honest about its drawbacks.
it isnt, another mike. this bill only forces insurance companies to act like human begins… something the right opposes.
here is my question…. and i hope one of the people on this site more learned in the ways of the congress than i can answer. how far (if at all) more left can this get pushed in commitee?
A.,
I don’t think the bill will be changed too much but whatever changes that will be made will be for the better. The conference committee bill can still be filibustered but what is likely is more generous subsidies and faster rollout. The worst the bill will be is the current Senate bill.
Harkin and Rockefeller are already working on a public option bill to be introduced in the coming year. So a reconciliation fight could be coming.
DD is right that the Republicans are really screwed on this. What are they going to campaign on – vote for us we’ll take away your health care? They bet everything on stopping Obama and used extremely dishonest rhetoric to do this.
“What are they going to campaign on – vote for us we’ll take away your health care?”
What’s there to take away? All that people get for the first few years is the bill.
K: Spndng n NHS [Ntnl Hlth Srvc] brcrc p pr cnt Th Tlgrph ^ | // | Lr Dnnll Spndng n NHS brcrc hs rsn b pr cnt n jst fr yrs, ccrdng t “hrtbrkng” gvrnmnt fgrs. Th ncrss ncld pr cnt rs n th csts f mngrs, whl spndng n clrcl stff rs b pr cnt t Prmr Cr Trsts (PCTs), whch dcd hw NHS fnds shld b sd. Mnwhl, thr xpndtr n mngmnt cnsltnts nd tmprr stff mr thn dbld. Ptnts’ grps ccsd th Gvrnmnt f wstng “ldcrs nd hrtbrkng” sms xpndng n rm f dmnstrtrs whl strvng th frntln f rsrcs.
What are they going to campaign on – vote for us we’ll take away your health care?
Are you kidding? Their attack ads write themselves. Remember, they are Republicans, so the ads don’t even have to be true.
First of all, it will be years before any significant numbers of people feel the benefits of this bill, if in fact the benefits do materialize, which is arguable. It will certainly be plausible to attack Dems for massive spending on a bill that hasn’t created any tangible benefits.
Republicans will, with a straight face, accuse Dems of a giveaway to special interests (insurance companies), while they also attack us for a government takeover of health care.
Picture Harry and Louise led away from their kitchen table in handcuffs for not buying health insurance.
They will lump TARP and HCR togther in attack ads about the largest deficits in history. Never mind that TARP was Bush’s baby.
They will find businesses that cancelled their health plans or laid off workers rather than pay additional fees.
The ads will be shrill, untruthful, unfair, and highly effective.
Someone gets it. I don’t know what is worse, the transparently devious sophistry of the Republicans or the Democrats inability (unwillingness) to contend against it. Although, having said that, there is one group of Democrats that gets it. The fundraising class. They are great at sending me emails to me that see the Republican game plan clearly and know what needs to be done to confront it.
I don’t send any money anymore because I have come to realize that I was being played as a sucker, buy a fundraising operation that had no influence with actual elected officials.
Bottom Line: The Democrats are screwed this mid-term. How’s the bi-partisanship working for you Mr. President.
they have had 2 terms to get it right….and they haven’t at all.
wait, cash for clunkers worked…sorta
the American people are tired of sorta though
I see we have upgraded to memory hole 2.0