Sanders: not a member of (and still not giving a shit about) the Democratic Party
My biggest problem with Bernie has always been that he is not a Democrat, so this letter from a Vermonter posted at TPM hit me like a punch in the nuts. It is the best articulation of the anti-Sanders position I’ve heard.
Vermonter here who has voted repeatedly for Bernie for statewide office but who will vote for Hillary on March 1.
You gave Reader MJ’s remark the headline “Feeling the Semi-Bern.” MJ asks for your thoughts on it all, which you haven’t yet provided. But let me remind you and everyone else out there: Sanders is not a member of the Democratic Party. Never has been and probably never will be.
Here in Vermont, there is a marriage of convenience between the Progressive Party and the Democratic Party, where (in statewide races, at least) there is usually only one candidate from either party to run for office. Up in Burlington, the parties often run against each other, but it rarely happens for statewide positions. Usually the Democratic Party candidate goes forward, but very often the Progressive candidate is the one who’s allowed to run. And sometimes they both run. Anthony Pollina is a great example of how these issues have played out over the last twenty years or so.
Bernie Sanders came into Congress in 1991 as an independent who identified with Vermont’s Progressive Party. He founded the Congressional Progressive Caucus. He’s caucused with the Democrats, but he has never joined the Democratic Party. In many ways, he is to the Democratic Party what Donald Trump is to the GOP: an outsider to the party who was welcomed in but who has been willing to wreck the party to achieve his own goals. Hence, all the vague talk from Sanders about a political revolution and no talk that I’ve heard or seen about how to build the Democratic Party in all fifty states.
Think about it: Sanders has shown little interest in building the fortunes of the Democratic Party. I mean that literally. I heard on the Chris Hayes show the other day that Clinton has raised millions for the DNC, while Sanders has raised $1,000. Sanders would argue that it’s important to get money out of the electoral process, but you can’t tell me that Sanders isn’t spending millions on himself. And I really don’t care if that money from small donors or not. Yes, Bernie is creating a movement, and that’s great. But at the end of the day, we’re likely to continue to have two political parties that will control much of the dialogue for years to come. I get the sense that many Progressives don’t give a second thought to what might be best for the Democratic Party overall, conveniently forgetting that representative and senators and governors come from parties many more times than not. There’s little to no thought among progressives about the depth of the bench of other elected officials. And that lack of strategic thought is one reason why I’ll vote for Clinton, because the Democratic Party will continue to be important, revolution or no revolution, and the Democratic Party will need to go toe-to-toe with the GOP, which means that the Democratic Party has to be strong. And unlike Bernie, Hillary is proud to call herself a member of the Democratic Party.
I’m very, very grateful that Bernie has moved the Democratic Party to the left. But I’m definitely not feeling the Bern up here in snowy Vermont.
I identify as a democrat mostly to oppose regressive Republican policies. I care about the fortunes of the democratic party as long as they do what i want.
I am not loyal to dems, they must compete for and earn my vote one election at a time and one candidate at a time. Because of that, i dont really care what Sanders wants to call himself or what he’s done with/to the party in the past. The welbeing of parties over the people as a whole is one of the biggest problems with this country. Understand that, and you’ll understand why Sanders and Trump (racism too..for Trump) are so popular. People who are too into their political party, however, will never understand that.
I’m not so much “into” my political party, but I do understand that we have a two party system, and the only counterweight to the regressive Republican Party is the deeply flawed, shit-ass Democratic Party.
Shouldn’t Sanders be a little more involved in fixing the only real counterweight to everything he claims to hate?
looks like your Bern is cooling a bit too, eh Jason? DD is grinning somewhere.
Given the history of what the democratic party has given us of late, good for Bernie.
He is very involved in fixing the Democratic Party. That’s why he’s running in as a Democrat. He’s fixing what needs fixing most. Ideas.
Ben, The Democratic Party is a fucked up loser hole, but it is the only fucked up loser hole with the capital and infrastructure to compete in every state and RD with the most vile and wrong headed political party to ever inflict itself on this country.
I just wish Bernie was a Democrat and some of this energy was being converted into fixed the fucked up loser hole.
LOL, Ben. This describes my feelings: “I’m very, very grateful that Bernie has moved the Democratic Party to the left.” But that is where my gratitude ends. He is not a Democrat, doesn’t care about party building, and therefore, he should not be the Party’s nominee for that reason alone. There are many other reasons, but that is my #1 reason. I know that means nothing to some of you who are not Democrats, but I am a tried and true Democrat, so it does mean something to me.
I mentioned this concern before about Bernie and money. If he wins the nomination I want him to court and take money from large donors. I want him to have SuperPacs. I want him to help other Democrats financially (and he should actually be contributing to them now), so that we can shoot for a friendlier Congress (which is the only way he gets anything done) and Governors.
If he wins the nomination he will be the head of the Democratic Party and he should make sure he, and the Dems running for other seats, doesn’t enter this upcoming election (which will be amazingly ugly and stunningly well funded on the GOP side) with one hand tied behind his back – which means taking every last cent he can get his hands on – yes, even from Wall Street.
Why would Bernie raise money for an entity that has tried to road block rule changes and a few other underhanded tricks to derail his campaign and lift up Clinton
Andy, you are proving my point. President Sanders is going to need a healthy, active Democratic Party. He should be building that now, but he seems to be out only for himself. Like it or not, Democracy in America is a team sport.
@Andy
“Why would Bernie raise money for an entity that has tried to road block rule changes and a few other underhanded tricks to derail his campaign and lift up Clinton”
Um… because he will need them to be elected in order to enact his agenda. Do you see another way of Bernie’s agenda happening? I’d be interested in hearing how you think Bernie can accomplish his agenda without building a friendly Congress.
Senator Tom Carper invests heavily every election for party building. And he is such an awesome democrat.
Just sayin’
My feelings exactly, Bernie started the campaign with the goal of pulling Hilary to the left and not much more. Having done so he now thinks he can win the nomination and the game has changed. This letter is a good insight into what is happening to the Dems and the progressive element within the party, we love what Bernie says but fear he will lose come November. I’ll vote for Hilary, Wall St. warts and all, defeat, and Cruz or Trump, is unthinkable. As for the Democratic party unless they change there are other Bernie’s in their future as progressives reject their current Republican Lite mentality.
“Bernie started the campaign with the goal of pulling Hilary to the left and not much more. Having done so he now thinks he can win the nomination and the game has changed. ”
Hillary hasn’t budged, except for a few rhetorical concessions. She has not made any significant pledges or real concessions to Bernie’s positions. Bernie will have to win a few more primaries for that to happen. That would put Hillary in the position of having to make specific plegges in order to win the support of Sanders supporters.
Once Hillary clinches the nomination her pivot to the right will be a thing to behold.
Senator Carper invests heavily in the Party… he doesn’t necessarily invest in party building. There’s a difference. Giving money hand over fist to make sure the lights stay on, and Votebuilder is updated in an election year doesn’t mean we’re building the party here in Delaware. In DE we need to do more to build the party in off-years. The same is true nationwide. This post is also my biggest issue with Bernie. But, I also want to make sure that when Hillary becomes the nominee that we aren’t just raising money for the sake of raising money for the party… that there is a plan in place and it has long-term sustainability… Whether you believed in it or liked it or not Howard Dean’s 50-State Strategy was at least a plan that for some states worked. (It was missing the long-term sustainability part, it was also missing the support of the next chairman).
Also, how do we make this an Election issue, or do we? Because raising money for the party so that we can get a working congress, and Governors who don’t suck, is just as important as making sure that Trump or anyone else from the GOP clown car isn’t the President.
This blog is called the Delaware Liberal not the Delaware Democrat. There are millions of Democrat’s who are upset at their party. The party has been stole from its own people. We don’t have to go far to see that. Look in Maryland, which is one of the most Blue States in the County. They have a Republican Governor now, because Democrat voters didn’t trust their own party.
Bernie is doing the Democratic Party a huge favor and the party doesn’t know it.
1. Look at all the people who are registering democratic
2. Look at all the people who are making individual donations
3. Most importantly he is not running as a third party candidate, which would kill any chance of the Democrat of winning the general elections, because of the split liberal vote.
David Axelrod said on tweeter ”When the exact same problems crop up in separate campaigns, with different staff, at what point do the principals say, “Hey, maybe it’s US?” The architect of the 2008 historic elections is saying Hillary biggest problem is Hillary.
http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/editorials/2016/02/18/clinton-can-withstand-gop-attack-machine/Mw3Mo9wowxfaslFKHRXm4L/story.html
At this point I am unsure if Clinton can beat Trump in the general. If Sanders is the Democratic nominee (a pope has to be Catholic, fortunately political parties have a lower standard), it becomes a contest between a non-Republican and a non-Democrat. Both are left of center (Trump even likes the health insurance mandate). Sanders is much further left of center than Trump.
After the primary, nominees have to tack to the center. Is Sanders limber enough at his age to contort himself enough to even get close to the center? I doubt it, but even if I am wrong, if you have Sanders and Trump in the center, who wins? Trump. He’s been continually discounted as serious candidate and yet almost has the GOP nomination locked up.
Even if all the Democrat likely voters for were to vote for the Democratic ticket, they would need to pick up a good chunk of the unaffiliateds to win. My assessment is that Clinton/Trump is at best even. Sanders/Trump is a Trump win when you consider likely voters.
Yes, yes, no.
It will depend on who can get the most non-voters to vote. trump obviously has the name rec. from having a hit network show for ten years, but once the full weight of the Democratic Party swings into action to support Sanders, he’ll even it up.
I’m really hoping for Cruz to win the nomination, because Trump scares me. He will easily co-op Sanders’ issues and “make them better.” I base this on how he’s doing the exact same thing to the GOP. He’s constantly morphing – and getting away with it. Hell, he’s benefiting from it. Even worse… He’s amazingly good at it.
His comments on Planned Parenthood and 9/11 have cross over appeal. Do. You. Have. Any. Idea. How. Scary. That. Is?
I know. I’ve said from the beginning – dems who want to face off against Trump are fooling themselves. Cruz or Bush. Those are the ones we want, but it looks like Bush will be out Monday or Tuesday.
You have been very consistent on that point, J. And I believe you. Add to my concerns Trump’s “talk” about taxing Wall Street. We could very well find ourselves in a race that isn’t about policy issue disagreements (even tho that would be true), but a race of who would do it better. I’m not comfortable with that scenario. because… the American public.
I get that Bernie and Hillary are trying not to alienate each others voters, but it’s time for them to take the gloves off and vet each other. I can name many ways to take each of them out in the general. We should be preparing for that.
“Shouldn’t Sanders be a little more involved in fixing the only real counterweight to everything he claims to hate?”
Nope. Until the Democratic Party is swept away, we will not have a real counterweight to the GOP.
Not being a Democrat is a feature, not a bug. And it’s not the president’s job to fix anyway. The last time the party was worth a shit was when Howard Dean ran it, and I don’t expect it to ever be worth a shit again.
We’re approaching a realignment of the parties, and when it’s all over the folks like John Manifold are going to be in the same party as the Chamber of Commerce and other “moderate” Republicans — which is where they have always belonged anyway.
“I can name many ways to take each of them out in the general. We should be preparing for that.”
This is the kind of thinking that produced the Maginot Line. Stop trying to pick people because they can withstand this or that criticism. Look how well that worked when the Democrats picked Kerry over Dean.
Geezer- There are no two tents big enough to cover everyone. Are seeing a three party system, because if not, I call bullshit on you realignment comment. We are structurally and tradition bound to squeeze into two parties.
“He’s constantly morphing – and getting away with it. Hell, he’s benefiting from it. Even worse… He’s amazingly good at it.”
All without spending a single dime of his or anyone else’s money for anything. It’s all free to him because he is Donald Trump.
Anyone can see the signs – a juggernaut, a rogue wave, a tsunami – the very big MO. He can do no wrong, say nothing wrong. He doesn’t have to tack to the center, or the left or the right during the primary or during the general. All he has to do is – act like Trump, which is convenient, because that’s who he is. At this point, even if everyone were to get off the Bernie Bus, there probably isn’t enough time or bros to make a difference.
And
“but it’s time for them to take the gloves off and vet each other. I can name many ways to take each of them out in the general.”
A good strategy if you believe that the primary and general are completely unrelated events not just separated by time but by amnesia. Your perception is that the traditional way of fighting it out during the primary and coalescing behind the chosen one who tacks to the center for the general to capture the independents and leaners, presumes that the independents and leaners haven’t already boarded the Trump Train.
I know many independents and leaners coast to coast (birds of the feather…) and many of them are simultaneously attracted and repelled by Trump. Their view is that he is much more of a centrists than all the others, but they are afraid he will be an embarrassment. They are desperately seeking a reason to not vote for Trump, but at this point they have no alternative, except to sit it out, which some them said they will do.
Guess we haven’t learned from our Kerry experience, Geezer, since we won’t even address what’s heading our way. But I’m not really talking about the inevitable “make up crap” attacks. I’m talking about very real weaknesses in our candidates.
One other thing… all this talk about massive turnout, so far, has been on the Republican side. Dem turnout is less than in 2008. That’s a problem, especially since citing massive turnout is a very vocal part of our strategy.
Dave, I think anything can happen in the general. I also know that many things hashed out in a primary lose their effectiveness in the general if the candidate has handled them and put them (mostly) to bed.
I also, also know that most actual voters don’t really start paying attention until after the conventions, usually in September. I also, also, also know that October surprises can impact a candidate and that debates (and the narrative that follows – winner! loser!) can change votes, just like a really bad or good VP pick.
There are a lot of moving parts. I’d like to stop some of them from moving before the general.
Trump is no centrist. The only center he wants is to be the center of attention.
Trump is a total dick. Always has been, always will be. He will abandoned any position and/or policy at a moments notice. Then Trump-splain it away as not his idea to begin with.
At some point, Trump has probably said something that everyone may have agreed with at one time or another. (For example, “we must stop companies leaving this country”) That doesn’t mean he means it or has any intent or ability to do anything about it.
In a normal election, no one would be paying attention except the political junkies. So you would be correct.
This is not a normal election. There’s never been this many candidates in the race for this long. There’s never has been a Trump (at least for real). People who have never watched a debate in their lives have watched the GOP debates because it’s the ultimate reality show. That includes likely voters. There never has been a viable woman candidate before.
A lot of people who never paid attention are paying attention now. Many of the are deciding now or at least deciding who they won’t support.
Finally, I think the media in general is figuratively salivating at the thought of a Trump presidency. Publicly they are aghast, privately they relish the thought of being able to act like a tabloid – (Your Fired). Hell they are almost wetting themselves over it. Look at MSNBC that bastion of the far left with their Trump townhall (full transcript: http://info.msnbc.com/_news/2016/02/17/35127534-full-transcript-msnbcs-town-hall-with-donald-trump?lite). Granted Scarborough is a Republican and apparently in Trump’s camp, so if there is someone else from the media that has managed to pin Trump down on any specifics, I’m all ears. Otherwise, I stand by my assertion that Trump has the media (and never had to spend a dime).
Look I’m really not one for hyperbole, nor am I a doom and gloomer, but I am seeing something I’ve never seen before. Call it the perfect storm if you will. The confluence of disparate interests all willing to bet on someone who no one knows whether he is a conservative or liberal because he transcends those labels. He is his own label. He is the 3rd party – his own party. And dissatisfied voters who are looking for a 3rd party found one and celebrity groupies flock to him. He’s even getting evangelicals for Christ sakes!
As I said, I doubt even Clinton could beat him at this point. It might be close, but I think Trump would win. I was unabashedly on the Clinton bandwagon. I still believe she would make an excellent president, but that’s no longer relevant. In the last few days I’ve come to the conclusion that there is nothing that is going to stop Trump because there is nothing he can do or say that affects his numbers and there is no candidate that is going to be able to compete with his Ugly American caricature that people almost seem proud about.
GOP despondent tonight. Won’t get to tear bark off Bernie. Even David Koch was propping him last week. Now he’s stuck with the blond Berlusconi.