This is why we don’t torture in America
Because when we do torture, we can no longer complain about the treatment of American citizens and soldiers, like the American journalists Laura Ling and Euna Lee, sentenced for spying on North Korea. Here is what they will be treated like during the next 12 years:
Conditions in camps for political prisoners [in North Korea] are even harsher and feature such pleasantries as “prolonged periods of exposure to the elements; humiliations such as public nakedness; confinement for up to several weeks in small ‘punishment cells’ in which prisoners were unable to stand upright or lie down; being forced to kneel or sit immobilized for long periods; being hung by the wrists; being forced to stand up and sit down to the point of collapse.”
Andrew Sullivan is right: sounds like Bush’s America to me.
Silly Liberal.
America is number #1! We are good, so everything we do is good even though it seems bad to people who don’t know how great and awesome America is. When we are evil it is evil that springs from the best of intentions.
That’s the difference.
It is the punishment common in the culture. That is why you don’t break the laws. A lot of foreign prisons aren’t great. That is why it is punishment. The problem we have is not the prison; it is the travesty.
What is stupid about the post is that you assume they would change their entire existing prison system to follow our example. What it shows is that we coddle our prisoners compared to much of the world. It is why your continued self flagellation is foolish. The people that you are trying to impress always behave in a way that you don’t like regardless of what you do.
My simple solution is don’t break foreign laws. It is not the business of the U. S. to worry about your voluntary actions in an area that we warn you is dangerous.
What is stupid about the post is that you assume they would change their entire existing prison system to follow our example.
This used to be called fighting for human rights.
The only thing stupid (and appalling) is that you don’t think that these rights are worth valuing here or anywhere else.
These are the least of the problems in PRK. The only reason the journalist are complaining is because those are two of their own. If they were fighting for human rights, they would be mentioning it before now.
It is life in PRK. What we should be talking about is the overall living conditions from prison to farm to town. It is a regime that starves children to be used as tools to get aid to build more weapons. Remember–screw it. Time to watch Sarah Palin.
There goes David A channeling Jesus again. I am sure that this is exactly what Jesus would write. He might even recommend bringing back crucifixions.
In David’s world, these journalists deserve this punishment for having the nerve and courage to risk their lives to report on one of the most despicable totalitarian regimes on the planet.
Appalling is exactly the right word, cassandra_m. David A. has shown himself to be fully allied with the enemies of freedom and against the most basic human rights, including freedom of the press.
Despicable. Absolutely despicable.
http://www.delawarepolitics.net/the-torture-myth/ Here is the real reason that we don’t. It has nothing to do with anyone else.
BTW most of what you described is not torture. Hanging from the wrists qualifies.
These are the least of the problems in PRK.
If you don’t have the basic rights you are born with, then you always have alot of problems.
You better not ever show back up here any platitudes about freedom and democracy. Never. You’ve just completely shown yourself to be completely unconcerned with either.
Despicable is right.
David just doesn’t get it. The problem with torture is not only that it’s wrong but that it hurts our standing in the world. We have lost our moral authority to pressure other regimes not to have kangaroo courts or not to torture. We’re not leading by example.
There is no reason to read David’s comments. My first comment is not a parody, it is his whole argument put in simple, plain terms.
But that’s the thing, isn’t it? Leading by example — hell, just plain leading — is of absolutely no interest to the wingnut class unless you get to hurt somebody in the process.
How very Christian of them.
In David’s world, Saddam Hussein would have been perfectly justified to execute all the international journalists in Iraq that wrote stories he did not like since there were laws against such writing.
In David’s world, it would have been perfectly acceptable for China to execute or imprison all the journalists who reported on Tienamen Square because they broke Chinese law by reporting on it.
In David’s world, it is perfectly acceptable to imprison, torture, and execute Christians who illegally proselytize or blasphemy Allah if it breaks that country’s laws.
I could go on and on. I am actually stunned that David A could have advocated for such an anti-American anti-human rights position. Unbelievable.
Luckily I doubt they’ll get the normal lil Kim treatment. They will be released at some point and the last thing he needs is horror stories about their incarceration. I think they get they kid glove treatment then get released. Good propoganda…
lil Kim-LOL DG!!!
Jason,
I know it’s not a parody, sadly.
“This used to be called fighting for human rights.”
Like in Iraq?
Iraq was WMDs — keep your rationalizations straight.
“most of what you described is not torture. Hanging from the wrists qualifies.”
Why? It doesn’t cause any permanent injuries or harm major organ systems. Quite frankly, what you or I consider torture doesn’t matter as much as what international law considers torture. Or, for that matter, that lawyers within the Bush DoJ believed that the combination of, um, harsh techniques, took it over the line.
BTW, there is not, never has been and almost certainly never will be a case of the “ticking time bomb” scenario you all love to fantasize about. In related news, that girl splayed out in “Wet Gash” magazine isn’t going to let you screw her, either.
Iraq was WMDs — keep your rationalizations straight.
You must believe in the tooth fairy. It was about deposing Sadaam Hussein.
Hmm… I do remember hearing something about a smoking gun turning into a mushroom cloud.